TalkCarswell.com

Where did all the choppers go?

According the the Commons Defense select committee, our troops lack enough helicopters in Afghanistan.

What they don't say is that's in part due to the fact we blew the helicopter budget. On a £1 billion order with a favoured contractor for helicopters that won't be ready until 2013.

At twice the price of proven alternatives. Which weren't even properly considered, since MoD failed to even run a competitive tender process.

Cui bono? Not our armed forces, that's for sure.

Posted on 16 July 2009 by Douglas Carswell

Comments

I've got what I think is a much better alternative to the way our military is funded presently, which I have extolled on LPUK's private forum; I will blog about it this weekend - it is radical and revolutionary but needs work to make it cohere.

Will let you know.

Posted on 16 July 2009 13:24 by Thom

Having listened over the last couple of days to the arguments that have been taking place in the commons I thought I would bring some things that you may or may not know to your attention in relation to the state of the rotary lift capacity of the MoD.

The eight Chinook Mk3 special forces helicopters purchased in 1996 will potentially cost £363 Million when (if) they become operational. The Prime Minister, Secretary of State for Defence and the PUS for Defence Procurement stated that some of these helicopters will be available at the end of the year. ZH897 has just entered the beginning of flight trials. Aircraft 2-8 are in various states of reversion and aircraft 8 has been cannibalised to such an extent that it is very unlikely that it will ever become operational. The likelihood of any of these aircraft being ready and available for operations this year is very slim. The aircrews have to be trained and flight certified, the ground crews have to be trained and certified. The aircraft has to be released as fit to fly and has to be retrofitted with the required DAS equipment that is still in trial at Boscombe Down to get it to theatre entry standard.

The UAE offered to buy the aircraft off the MoD.

You can buy a CH-47D which is the US standard Chinook or what we call the Mk2a for £20 Million.

JHC current order of battle states that it has 29 Chinook helicopters at its disposal for the front line (Source MoD Defence Statistics 2008).
Assume that a third of the fleet are at various states of, minor, major and primary star (categories of maintenance) so are unavailable for operations.
Assume that a third of the fleet is being used for continuation training, OCU and trials.
That leaves roughly 10 aircraft that can be deployed.
10 Chinook helicopters are currently deployed on Op Herrick.
Assume that a third of the deployed fleet are grounded due to maintenance etc
Therefore the UK Chinook force in Afghanistan is roughly 6 helicopters that can be provided by flight operations for duty.

JHC current order of battle states that it has 23 Puma helicopters at its disposal for the front line (Source MoD Defence Statistics 2008).
The Puma is non deployable to Afghanistan. It does not have the required power to operate within the flight envelope required by the user.

JHC current order of battle states that it has 6 Lynx AH7, 59 Lynx AH7/9 and 42 Gazelle helicopters at its deposal for the front line (Source MoD Defence Statistics 2008).
The Lynx and Gazelle helicopters are non deployable to Afghanistan. They do not have the required power to operate within the flight envelope required by the user.

JHC current order of battle states that it has 15 Merlin Mk3 (22 initial purchase) at its disposal for the front line.
Assume that a third of the fleet are at various states of, minor, major and primary star (categories of maintenance) so are unavailable for operations.
Assume that a third of the fleet are is being used for continuation training, OCU and trials.
That leaves roughly 4/5 aircraft that can be deployed.
4 Merlin helicopters are currently deployed to Iraq.
Assume that a third of the deployed fleet are grounded due to maintenance etc
Therefore the UK Merlin force in Iraq is roughly 3 helicopters that can be provided by flight operations for duty.

JHC current order of battle states that it has 3 Merlin Mk3a (6 purchased from Denmark). These aircraft were promised in 2008. Here we are in 2009 and still no deployable airframes.

JHC current order of battle states that it has 26 Sea King Mk4 at its disposal for the front line.
Assume that a third of the fleet are at various states of, minor, major and primary star (categories of maintenance) so are unavailable for operations.
Assume that a third of the fleet is being used for continuation training, OCU and trials.
That leaves roughly 8 helicopters that can be deployed.
CHF splits its time between supporting Op Herrick and supporting 3 Cdo Bde RM deployed at sea.

The MoD is spending £70 Million on re-engining (8) Lynx AH9 helicopters with uprated engines. These aircraft are delayed.

The MoD bought the Bell 412 (Huey) to be used in hot and high climates like, Cyprus, Belize and Brunei. These aircraft can be bought for £2 Million. The US Army is modernising Jordanian Huey aircraft for £2 Million with modern avionics, armour etc for the Iraqi air force.

The NH90 is available for £14 Million (Internet source) and shares the same engine as the Merlin. For £70 Million you could buy 7 NH90 and these aircraft come with the added bonus that they can be built at Westland.

The Puma fleet has had its day. They are short of Puma qualified pilots (11 short) and the aircraft is becoming more expensive to maintain. The MoD is short of rotary pilots. A pilot takes roughly 3 years to become combat ready. However OCU conversion to another type can take as little as 6 months.

The Lynx AH7/9 fleet is reaching the end of its operational usefulness. OCU conversion to another type can take as little as 6 months.

All military rotary pilots that use Chinook, Merlin, Sea King and Puma do their multi engine rotary training on the Bell 412 therefore they are type certified to fly it.

All Lynx AH7/9 pilots are introduced to the Bell 412 so are aware of it.

That is where all the helicopters have gone.

Or put it another way.
MoD - 536 rotary assets
Op Herrick - 18 rotary assets
As the PM likes to talk percentages that means 3.35% is all we can deploy to Afghanistan. 60% and 84% are suddenly put into perspective aren't they. Remember that number next time the PM spouts out 60% and 84%.

3.35

Posted on 16 July 2009 13:33 by Lee Hannaford

Rember Mr Carswell that just under half of the Lynx Wildcats (28 out of 62) are for the Royal Navy in the Maritime Attack/light ASW role and are exactly the right choice of aircraft for the Royal Navy.

As Lee Hannaford has said above the Bell 412 Griffin would be a good choice for an off the shelf hot and high helicopter. Much better than the Sikorsky alternative which you sometimes plug.

At the heavy end, additional Merlins would be a good idea (to replace Pumas and Sea Kings for the Royal Navy/Royal Marines and the Royal Air Force. Additional Chinooks would also be a good idea.

Posted on 17 July 2009 00:23 by Will Yoxall

Lee, a very good summary of the situation which I agree with. Bell 412 pricing should be £8M equipped for an aircraft which is not worn-out or in regular need of maintenance. The US are refurbishing knackered UH-1s (not 412s) for the Iraqi Air Force, probably just to save short-term cash - the long-term cost of these airframes will be steep because of their age. All still a drop in the ocean for our defence budget, though!

Posted on 17 July 2009 14:21 by JP

Your other correspondents are so well informed that I'm a little surprised at my own temerity in daring to follow them. Details aside, it is clearly dishonourable that operational requirements in the field, where servicemen are dying in the course of duty, are permitted to take second place to economic considerations. But is this not the result of having in office politicians who aren't statesmen? Politics, the art of gaining and holding power, isn't an end but a means. Statesmanship, the art of using power, is the proper end. I fear we have a system that rewards politicians and rejects statesmen. Is this inevitable in a popular democracy? Or are we just unlucky right now?

Posted on 17 July 2009 17:39 by eeyore

This is hugely damning - http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2009/07/saintly-dannatt.html

Posted on 17 July 2009 19:12 by John Page

http://www.defenseworld.net/go/defensenews.jsp?id=3174&h=Pakistan%20receives%20four%20Mi-17%20helicopters%20from%20US%20anti-Taliban

It appears to be an appropriate choice of hardware for the situation and delivered promptly to theatre where it's needed.

Posted on 18 July 2009 07:08 by mat

If the MoD and it's officers and civil servants are not benefiting from the billions of pounds spent on defence contracts; which explains the pathetic performance of the MoD, then I am, of course, a nasty Communist who is trying to stop them getting really rich which, if they have been to a private school, is their birthright.

Posted on 22 July 2009 17:20 by James Yates

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